Comments on: Barack Obama’s Policy on Disability: Segregation is the Way… http://www.dominickevans.com/2008/02/barack-obamas-policy-on-disability/ Tue, 07 Sep 2010 04:51:31 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: Dominick http://www.dominickevans.com/2008/02/barack-obamas-policy-on-disability/comment-page-1/#comment-338 Dominick Mon, 10 Nov 2008 02:38:29 +0000 http://www.dominickevans.com/?p=44#comment-338 Thanks for the long and informative comment Tom. First, the income limits for social security/SSI/SSDI/Medicare/Medicaid need to be removed (or lifted to higher amounts) from those deemed to be disabled, so they can make some sort of living for themselves and still maintain medical insurance. Many employers and many insurance companies won't take on employees with disabilities for their insurance plans due to preexisting conditions. It's not cool or fair. This practice also needs to be changed. Second, employers need to get their heads out of their asses and realize that in some instances, a qualified person with a disability is as good a worker (if not better) than an able-bodied individual. It may be economically easier to hire an AB worker, but that doesn't mean that AB individual is as good at the job as the disabled person could have been. Still, by the same token, a disabled person may not be the best candidate. Essentially, hiring an employee should be done on merit, not on AB or disabled status. There aren't many fair opportunities for those with disabilities out there. To survive, many of us have to make our own successes. Thanks for the long and informative comment Tom.

First, the income limits for social security/SSI/SSDI/Medicare/Medicaid need to be removed (or lifted to higher amounts) from those deemed to be disabled, so they can make some sort of living for themselves and still maintain medical insurance. Many employers and many insurance companies won’t take on employees with disabilities for their insurance plans due to preexisting conditions. It’s not cool or fair. This practice also needs to be changed.

Second, employers need to get their heads out of their asses and realize that in some instances, a qualified person with a disability is as good a worker (if not better) than an able-bodied individual. It may be economically easier to hire an AB worker, but that doesn’t mean that AB individual is as good at the job as the disabled person could have been.

Still, by the same token, a disabled person may not be the best candidate. Essentially, hiring an employee should be done on merit, not on AB or disabled status.

There aren’t many fair opportunities for those with disabilities out there. To survive, many of us have to make our own successes.

]]> By: Tom McClure http://www.dominickevans.com/2008/02/barack-obamas-policy-on-disability/comment-page-1/#comment-337 Tom McClure Mon, 10 Nov 2008 02:24:41 +0000 http://www.dominickevans.com/?p=44#comment-337 I am an employment counselor. I frequently read this sort of rant against sheltered workshops, but I would have the readers consider alternatives offered and the reality of the job market. Sheltered workshops also called Community Employment Centers are legally allowed to pay their employees less than minimum wage, solely based upon their productivity. This is much of the source of the charge of exploitation. But, they are one of the few sites for simple work left in the economy. Yes, some of their jobs might still occur in other factories, but often the worker might be expected to move back and forth among simple and complex jobs. What would make jobs complex? I recently visited a small factory that made and packaged adhesives (mostly construction adhesives). For the compounders, they had to compute weights of each component in kilograms down to two decimal places for the ratios of components. And then they had to carefully measure out the materials. If they over ran one item, they then had to compute the various make-up amounts. Then the mixer was run and when all the materials were mixed, the material had to be put into packages. While the material mixed, the required number of containers were prepared. Again a lot of computation. This was not a company setting out to exclude employees, but one that was seriously seeking employees. But their employees needed to have done well in math in high school, not just passed. Almost all companies now require their employees to be able to enter information into computers. The fear of computers I see in older workers makes them unemployable. We do need companies that can still do jobs in an old-fashioned way for all those employees that work slower or who have not mastered computer controled machines or who have not mastered complicated set-ups done in metric measure. We need jobs where people can just work hard, not smart, to do the job. By 2025 something like 85% of jobs will need some college (usually community college) to do the job. It may not be all the job, but esential parts. Even traditional "simple jobs" such as landscaping or janitorial or food service are becoming more complex. Few of those jobs can be done without reading both numbers and words. Accurate measurement is often eimportant. Even janitors need to be able to read and understand chemical names and know what can and cannot be mixed. Everything comes concentrated and is mixed to a working solution. And janitors now operate floor scrubbing machines and carpet cleaning machines, not just push a broom. Workshops and rehabilitation organizations do provide job coaches (badly underpaid and often poorly trained) to teach the newer jobs systematically and to competency. However they will become a permanent part of the employment picture because jobs change every few years and until that work force can do their own learning they will need the job coach, who is an additional expense. And those who complain about taxes will say it is cheaper to give a minimum to keep starvation away than to give that person a real job, especially if it requires two persons to do one person's job. What are the alternatives? There are clubhouses. Originally they were seen as clubs where members learned how to do simple service jobs such as food service, cleaning, and customer assistance while providing those services to other members. But again there is little follow up to move the members out of this kind of segregated setting. Is a club for disabled only any more integrated than an factory for disabled? Is a group home with only disabled residents (usually only from one type of disability) any more inclusive? At least the simplified factory did feel like a job. May factory workers don't like their jobs any more than this person liked a workshop. (I don't think he really participated in one, or he would at least express some satisfaction at having some sort of job and having some sort of normality.) But if these are not important to him, he is right. As for being segregated, most jobs are segregated by definition. The employees tend to come from one area, from one socio-economic group, from one outlook. Because that is what is wanted by the employer. They may be integrated by race and religion, but little else. And if special services are needed, we do not generally think of the facility as being "segreated." We do not call a hospital segreated because is serves sick. We do not call a school segregated because it serves young and uneducated. We do not call a college segregated because it serves academically gifted and striving. Of course you can complain and bitch. It is everyone's right. But, if you want to go beyond griping, you need to propose an alternative that is economically, socially, and practically able to be done and really does overcome your objections. I am an employment counselor. I frequently read this sort of rant against sheltered workshops, but I would have the readers consider alternatives offered and the reality of the job market. Sheltered workshops also called Community Employment Centers are legally allowed to pay their employees less than minimum wage, solely based upon their productivity. This is much of the source of the charge of exploitation. But, they are one of the few sites for simple work left in the economy. Yes, some of their jobs might still occur in other factories, but often the worker might be expected to move back and forth among simple and complex jobs. What would make jobs complex?
I recently visited a small factory that made and packaged adhesives (mostly construction adhesives). For the compounders, they had to compute weights of each component in kilograms down to two decimal places for the ratios of components. And then they had to carefully measure out the materials. If they over ran one item, they then had to compute the various make-up amounts. Then the mixer was run and when all the materials were mixed, the material had to be put into packages. While the material mixed, the required number of containers were prepared. Again a lot of computation. This was not a company setting out to exclude employees, but one that was seriously seeking employees. But their employees needed to have done well in math in high school, not just passed. Almost all companies now require their employees to be able to enter information into computers. The fear of computers I see in older workers makes them unemployable. We do need companies that can still do jobs in an old-fashioned way for all those employees that work slower or who have not mastered computer controled machines or who have not mastered complicated set-ups done in metric measure. We need jobs where people can just work hard, not smart, to do the job. By 2025 something like 85% of jobs will need some college (usually community college) to do the job. It may not be all the job, but esential parts.
Even traditional “simple jobs” such as landscaping or janitorial or food service are becoming more complex. Few of those jobs can be done without reading both numbers and words. Accurate measurement is often eimportant. Even janitors need to be able to read and understand chemical names and know what can and cannot be mixed. Everything comes concentrated and is mixed to a working solution. And janitors now operate floor scrubbing machines and carpet cleaning machines, not just push a broom. Workshops and rehabilitation organizations do provide job coaches (badly underpaid and often poorly trained) to teach the newer jobs systematically and to competency. However they will become a permanent part of the employment picture because jobs change every few years and until that work force can do their own learning they will need the job coach, who is an additional expense. And those who complain about taxes will say it is cheaper to give a minimum to keep starvation away than to give that person a real job, especially if it requires two persons to do one person’s job.
What are the alternatives? There are clubhouses. Originally they were seen as clubs where members learned how to do simple service jobs such as food service, cleaning, and customer assistance while providing those services to other members. But again there is little follow up to move the members out of this kind of segregated setting. Is a club for disabled only any more integrated than an factory for disabled? Is a group home with only disabled residents (usually only from one type of disability) any more inclusive? At least the simplified factory did feel like a job. May factory workers don’t like their jobs any more than this person liked a workshop. (I don’t think he really participated in one, or he would at least express some satisfaction at having some sort of job and having some sort of normality.) But if these are not important to him, he is right. As for being segregated, most jobs are segregated by definition. The employees tend to come from one area, from one socio-economic group, from one outlook. Because that is what is wanted by the employer. They may be integrated by race and religion, but little else. And if special services are needed, we do not generally think of the facility as being “segreated.” We do not call a hospital segreated because is serves sick. We do not call a school segregated because it serves young and uneducated. We do not call a college segregated because it serves academically gifted and striving.
Of course you can complain and bitch. It is everyone’s right. But, if you want to go beyond griping, you need to propose an alternative that is economically, socially, and practically able to be done and really does overcome your objections.

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